The only problem I have with the NRA is their lack of fighting for people who had done their crime and done their time to get their full gun rights back. I don't think people should be punished forever for nonviolent offenses. There are so many nonviolent felonies that make the loss of gun rights for hilarious at best. These would include:

1. Fraud
2. Money laundering
3. Any computer crime, no matter what, is NOT violent
4. DUI, on what ever offense time makes it a felony
5. Embezzlement
6. Tax evasion
7. Dog fighting
8. Cruelty to animals, 3rd offense (really, losing gun rights because you don't feed your dog? c'mon)
9. Felony reckless driving
10. Conspiracy to commit any of the above, or any 3rd offense misdemeanor (just because you do something little 3 times doesn't make it BIG all of a sudden)

Now this isn't about whether we think these crimes are ok, just whether they should result in someone losing their gun rights for any period of time, even life in some cases. I committed an offense on the computer almost 10 years ago and now it will take a miracle for me to EVER get my gun rights back. Before then and since, I don't even have a traffic ticket. I always voted. Participated in my community. Had many guns, even a concealed carry permit which I used all the time when outdoors. Yet someone who beat his wife can keep their guns. Now I'm hated because of my ignorance and not knowing what I was doing long before anyone knew it was even a problem. Just for the record, I have been granted my full voting rights back.

What's really funny is that in my state, a murderer can get their gun rights back. As long as they are alive long enough to do their time, get out and do parole, and live 10 years past the end of parole, they can file for and receive full gun rights. But being as how my mess is federal, federal is forever, no matter level of violence or anything, unless you get a pardon from the president.

This country is great, but sometimes, it sucks. They talk about second chances but where are they?

no, they can't... not if they have a domestic violence conviction on their record anyways...
well, that not entirely true... if you are a cop and you are convicted of domestic violence, you can keeps your guns.. cops are a protected class all on their own, they aren't normal people under the law.

you lose gun rights for all sorts of stupid sh*t .. that i'll agree to.. and it takes a lot of money and time to get them back ( if you are eligible to petition the court).
you've had years and years and years of anti-gun groups lobbying, and winning, concessions all over the place...it's going to take decades to reverse the damage.

oh, and the NRA is a joke.. switch your allegiance, and money, to the SAF... they don't sell out like the NRA does.

I forgot about the domestic violence thing. That would be the example I use! Oh well, you plainly get the point I was trying to make.

What shocked me, someone who had a clean record, college degree, a pillar of the community is smashed in the face out of left field one morning and his life is changed forever. How fast it happened, wow. Well, it's over now. Moving on....

Man that sucks. I wasn't aware you could lose your right to own a gun in the US for non-violent offenses. Seems really unfair to me.

Can you get wife/girlfriend to get one to keep at home or do they ban the whole household?

I'm currently tring to talk my g/f into getting a license, she's Fillipino and we have an apartment in Manila and I want a gun, so I'm going that route as I'm not allowed one anywhere (being British).

Felony offenses can lose you the right to do a lot of things, those rights can also be returned with time and effort. If you lose your rights due to criminal activity, it's up to you to prove that you are able to function properly in society. That's the way the law is set up, and I happen to agree with it to a certain extent.

My uncle's collection of firearms had to be divied up after the SEC got him. got convicted and spent a little time in jail and now can't have his guns/vote? he was convicted not by his peers but by the 12 people who couldnt get out of jury duty. his peers would have been ceos that understood what was going on... anyway, its bullpatties that they can't own guns. that's something that everyone should be entitled to

Snake, you are wrong. ONLY state crimes can you do that with, ANYTHING federal is for life unless pardoned by the president.

What's REALLY frustrating is that what I did was a misdemeanor in at LEAST one state for sure. Probably more. Had the state picked up my case, I'd be well on my way to expungement and gun ownership again. But the feds picked it up, so it's there forever.

In the majority of States, the right to vote is returned after the offenders debt to society has been paid, i.e. they successfully complete their prison term, probation, or parole, and are no longer under the custody of the criminal justice system. In some States, that right is restored immediately, in others, there's a waiting period. Maine and Vermont permit felons the right to vote, even during incarceration. The only two States that do not have a re-enfranchisement policy are Alabama and Tennessee, and that only applies to felons found guilty of heinous crimes and/or treason.

The Fifth Amendment disagrees:

No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation



It sucks that you lost your rights, but if you aren't willing to accept the consequences, you shouldn't have broken the law in the first place. I told my brother the same thing after he was convicted of a felony crime in the State of Texas.

The consequences should match the crime. Nothing done on a computer is violent, thus nothing done with a computer mouse should result in the loss of gun rights. AT what point have I paid my debt to society and I'm considered a member again? If I can't have my guns, I shouldn't have to pay taxes. It's not fair that I have to pay taxes to a gov't that won't let me have my guns back. In not having guns, I am vulnerable to vigilante violence. Why is that fair? Why do I lose my right to defend myself 10 years after committing a computer crime that was almost unheard of back then? So tell me Snake, why?

I won't get into the details of my case because it's pretty obvious you have no CLUE about our justice system, but my "crime" started out as trying to get music for a CD for my mother for mothers day.

Yea, I should have thought about losing my gun rights when doing such a heinous crime.

I've told people about my situation and had them say "Oh hell, I've done much worse, I just never got caught." So you don't lose your gun rights if you do something wrong, you only lose them if you get caught. Sounds like an "injustice system" to me. How many people are walking around free going hunting on the weekend and molesting their children each night? Without being caught, they are a "stand up" member of society.

You don't want me to start spitting out stats at you. I'd bury you like a coffin.

This country has more people in prison than any other country. That says a lot about our justice system. No other developed country is a Poo with its laws as ours. Did you know that 25% of our adult population has a criminal record?

You can try that angle if you want. I wouldn't advise it.

Because you violated federal law, and through Due Process, your rights have been waived. You must have heard somewhere that ignorance of the law is no excuse?

Sounds like tough luck. You still got caught, and it's still a federal crime.

You committed a crime, and didn't think there would have been consequences, yet I'm the one who has no clue about the Justice System. You must have a lack in reading cognition as well, because the majority of my post (you know, the part about heinous crimes permanently preventing citizens of Alabama and Tennessee from voting) was directed at Mr. Galt.


Sounds like you need to take all that energy you use crying about it, and focus it into doing something about it.

I honestly don't care about your stats, because you're living in your own little world of how things should be. If things were the way they should be, my job wouldn't be necessary, and we'd all live happily ever after. Unfortunately, we live in the real world.


This is relevant to nothing. Stop complaining, and focus on how to get yourself out of the mess you created. Or you can just be miserable for the rest of your life, constantly thinking about all the stuff you should have done. That's up to you.

I'm not miserable at all. I have more licenses and credentials at age 30 then you will ever have in your entire life. I own a truck, 4 wheeler, boat, tractor, motorcycle, have great friends, etc etc. I'm only speaking in this thread about how no one seems to agree it makes sense to remove my gun rights for what I did.

You, not knowing me from Adam, seem to be the only one I can find who really thinks it makes sense to remove gun rights for a computer crime. Did you know that originally "felony" was only meant to describe violent offense like rape and murder? NOT silly things like money laundering and computer crimes. To put murder and money laundering under the same label makes the label irrelevant at that point.

If you knew so much you would know my crime was state, not federal, but the feds decided to pick it up because my prosecutor had a wild hair up his ass and wanted to "make an example out of me" (in reality he wanted bragging rights). Had the EXACT SAME CHARGE been picked up by the state, I would be literally a few years from owning a gun again. (and in at least one state, I wouldn't have ever lost my gun rights as it was a MISDEMEANOR) You really have no clue. I've been through the justice system, you have not. I have seen how broken it is. You have not. Speak not of what you don't know, lest you make yourself look like an idiot. I didn't even want what I was caught with, even the judge agreed, but said that since the prosecutor said he wanted to make an example out of me, he was going to press charges that I couldn't fight. The judge said even HE wished his hands weren't tied. And guess what? A year later, a ruling came out untying his hands. People are walking with the exact same charge who were charged months after me. So pretty much everyone I talk to whose got an ounce of brain in their head agrees, I was royally Sacrebleued over by this country's injustice system.

I am done with you. Your replies to this thread will hereby be ignored. You are a good mod, nothing against you personally, but I'm done with you here. Anyone else have anything intelligent to add?

Good for for you, I didn't realize this was a dick measuring contest. You really don't want to go there with me.

You're right, I don't know you, and I don't really care about your accomplishments and credentials, because all I'm hearing from you is a lot of whining and bragging. It doesn't matter what a felony used to be, this isn't back in the day, it's now, and you committed, and were found guilty of, a federal offense. Again, if you want to change things, stop worrying about the way things were, and focus on how things are now. The past is gone, stop dwelling on it, stop whining, and focus on taking charge of your life. So you got some high dollar equipment, if material possessions are what make you happy in life, good for you. If you want a damned gun so badly, go get one. Figure out how to do it, and execute. I deal with guns every day, they're hardly anything remarkable.

I read it the first time. I ignored it, because it's irrelevant.


I have an expunged ruling of deferred adjudication for possession. Spent four long, miserable, months in county, six months in a correctional boot camp, and six years on probation. I had to deal with the same process again when my brother was sent up for burglary. The difference is that I didn't bitch and complain, I did my time, and did what I had to do to restore my rights. So don't tell me I don't know about the law, or the difficulties in restoration of rights. The key is staying vigilant, and not giving up. So stop complaining, feigning offense, and acting tough, and take charge of your f**king life. If you want it bad enough, you'll get it done.


You should take your own advice.


I've retired as a moderator now, and I'm done with you as well, since you don't appear to have the fortitude to fix what's broken, and assume that you're the only one that got f**ked by the system. Six years of probation, six months boot camp, four months county jail, and 300 hours of community service for two lousy joints. But guess what? I got free, waited my time, paid a lawyer to expunge my record, and now I have all of my rights, I'm an NCO in the US Army, I'm in charge of Soldiers, I'm in charge of maintaining millions of dollars of equipment, and I'm in charge of my life. I didn't do that by sitting on my ass, complaining about how I got f**ked. Hopefully, you will come to that conclusion some day. Nothing is hopeless, especially this.

HOly Poo man. You got Fed in the A on that one.

I didn't say that it was illegal for the government to remove them. I said it's bullsh*t and he should be entitled to it.

He should, but he isn't. That's what we allowed the government to do in the name of morals and safety.